This past week, a conspiracy theory's been brewin' about E.X Troopers, the cel-shaded Lost Planet spin-off for the Nintendo 3DS and PlayStation 3. Purportedly, E.X. Troopers is a regurgitated Mega Man Legends 3 built around the latter's assets; gameplay mechanics, graphical style and character design. This video sums up the theory nicely.
Naturally, the discerning masses took to Ask Capcom to get to the bottom of this. It wasn't long before Seth Killian popped in to sort things out:
"For what it's worth, I can tell you I played an early version of this game (which was styled in the same way, and with what looks to be similar gameplay) in Japan well before the Legends project ran into trouble. It is definitely not a reskinned Legends. I have not played EX Troopers for quite a while, but once more details emerge about the gameplay, I think it will become clearer that this is the case.
At the time I played it, the projects did not share members. Since the MML3 team is now on other projects, it's conceivable some are working on this title, but that would be the extent of the overlap so far as I know."
And there you have it. I admit the two still look a bit alike, but I think that's largely due in part to the presence of Capcom's MT Framework engine. If you recall, MT Framework was developed alongside the original Lost Planet with a then-hypothetical Legends 3 in mind. Flash forward to 2010 and sure enough, Legends 3 was reportedly powered by the very same engine.
From the looks of it, E.X Troopers seems to be powered by MT Framework (or something very similar). And honestly, that's pretty much all the two games share. The blonde haired kid? Meh, it is what it is.
Source: Ask Capcom
knew it all along.
ReplyDeleteGod I hope this gets cancelled, if only because I love coincidences.
ReplyDeleteBedankt voor het delen van deze inzichtelijke blogpost! Je hebt waardevolle kennis gegeven over het belang van make-upspiegels en hun voordelen. Wij bieden ook een reeks make up spiegel van hoge kwaliteit tegen betaalbare prijzen. Bezoek ons gerust voor meer informatie en verbeter uw schoonheidsroutine!
DeleteYou think Capcom would come out and say, yes you got us this is using Legends 3's engine and assests? Of course not, the blonde guy is not a coincidence... neither is the art style and system of choice.
ReplyDeleteHow could you tell Seth's telling the truth? We all know Capcom is a freakin' liar when it comes to MML3 remodeled to something different. We'll just have to tell everybody around the world NOT to buy this game so we could rip Capcom off.
ReplyDeleteI think it's pretty clear it's got nothing to do with it. And really, something like this would be in development a while. I may not take everything Capcom employees have to say at their word, but I believe Seth is telling the truth about having played an early version of this in 2010.
ReplyDeleteNow, VoiceOfReason... I have to say, the "blonde guy" is really circumstantial at best. It's such a generic character design, it's hardly a smoking gun. I mean, I haven't gone through to check it, but for all we know, every Capcom game has a guy that looks just like that in it somewhere as some sort of running gag.
Either way, saying that "blonde guy" is a sign that the game is a reworked Mega Man Legends 3 is almost as ridiculous as me saying "Gabriel Cunningham in Trauma Team has a similar design to Spike Spiegel, so Trauma Team must be reusing assets from a cancelled Cowboy Bebop game."
Anyway, I say we all stay patient at this point. If you look at how many immovable giants responded to fan movements/backlash in the last year (meaning Nintendo and Cartoon Network, on Xenoblade/The Last Story and Toonami respectively) it's hard to imagine that Capcom is going to continue holding stubborn when they know they've done wrong. We're hardly entitled to Legends 3, but at the same time releasing it would be one of the few things that can help remove the stigma they've given themselves. But we'll see. I don't know anything about what Capcom has planned, but maybe they'll have something at E3. Or not. Like I said, we'll see.
It has a 2013 release date.
ReplyDeleteAlso before anyone argues 'zomg MT framwork must mean it's stealing stuff from Legends 3' may I point out every major Capcom game on the 3DS, Street fighter IV, both Resident Evils, and Monster Hunter, have all used the engine.
Also I feel like the cell shading style is slightly different,since parts seemed to be outlined in black, but at the same time not enough for me to cry Okami. It seems to be more hybrid between that games cell shading and Legends 3 cell shading rather than either one.
In short, eh it feels like people are trying to grab at anything they can.
I personally think they got their just deserts with Street Fight X Tekken, their baby for this year. It didn't sell the 2 million they wanted, it's suffering problems from their own updates, and they were NAILED for the on disc DLC which they are now being forced to reconsider in future games. Anything now is overkill in my opinion.
@VoiceOfReason: Prove it. :3
ReplyDeleteBullshit.
ReplyDeleteIt's very similar. There's no getting around that. The video does have some good points. Still, we just have to take Seth's word for it. Evidence prove it's not the same game says Killian, but it's a bit disheartening that this gets greenlit and pushed when Legends 3, still very similar and widely wanted, does not.
ReplyDeleteI mean, who thought "Hey! I want an anime styled Lost Planet for the 3DS!", while tons and tons of people openly wanted, practically pleaded for Legends 3. I've said it before and it just proves that it's ALL about the money. Fans as a factor are very low on the list, at least with Capcom.
@Megamac: I kinda wanted a Lost Planet title on a Nintendo system.... Especially since Tatsunoko vs Capcom.... Not necessarily in this style, but still nevertheless.
ReplyDelete@Takara: Eh two issues with those arguments.
A) It took no money to bring Toonami back. It just meant they'd have more viewers for that time slot and have a better reason to air certain TV shows.
B)Xenoblade, Last Story, Pandoras Tower were all done games. All they needed was VAs, a slight change in their region locking code, and off they went. I don't know if Last Story is getting new Voice Actors for the NA version, since Xseed is responsible for it, but Xenoblade just used the European voice actors.
Legends 3 isn't a done game. The prototype is a prologue to the actual game, meaning money still has to be sunk into that thing. You can't easily use a done game that was petitioned for, a remake, nor a title with a big name behind it(Kid Icarus) to argue as to why Legends 3 should return. They aren't equal arguing points.
You want Legends 3 to happen? You gotta fix these problems, both the fans and Capcom.
A) Get a name behind it. Doesn't matter who, get a big name behind it. Every case of Pikmin 2 had 'Made by Shigeruu Miyamoto' which was a selling point. Without Keiji, who already is kind of losing his namepower in the game industry and kind of was as the Megaman franchise went down more and more, it's lacking names behind it. Even if you BS about it, it would help.
B) More of Volnutt. The lack of him in videos and pictures scared off many fans. Hoffman said Capcom told him Volnutt was playable in the prototype, but he was never told or shown how. It's MEGAMAN Legends 3, give us the man in charge.
C) Get those 100 000 and actually have them join the Devroom. It's sitting at around 20 000. Also, aim higher. 300 000 should be an excellent next target and be more convincing to Capcom. If Darkstalkers needs 500 000 for a new game, I doubt Capcom will give Megaman an exception unless it was the BN series.
D) Fix his god damn reputation. Get the god damn games released on the Virtual Consoles, on the PSN, on XBLA. Get him in the crossovers. Get off your asses and fix the legal situation Legends 1+2+Tron are in and get them on the PSN at the very least, and the 64 version as well. AND NEVER DO WHAT YOU DID IN SFxT AGAIN.
Do that and you'll actually have a chance of success in Legends 3.
I'm still angry.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous: While I agree that there is more to MML3 than the other things, keep in mind that part of all three of these things is reception. Xenoblade, The Last Story, Pandora's Tower, and Toonami all require an audience and a shot at making them some revenue. The potential money is there for Legends 3. I'm not saying it's going to be a super mega awesome platinum over 9000 popular game, but it will sell decently. Capcom can, and has utilized small print runs to ensure the success of a title, but they don't seem keen on doing that anymore, they seem delusional about it. What was it, sell 5 million copies of Dragon's Dogma, wasn't it? It looks pretty good, honestly, but I'm not sure I want to buy it.
ReplyDeleteAnd it did take money to bring Toonami back. One must keep in mind they need advertising partners, they need programming, and the rights to programming isn't cheap. They need to have advertising partners that will be able to sell their products to the target audience, while at the same time are making enough to continue advertising. Part of what killed Toonami before? Their ad partners weren't making enough money they could attribute back to Toonami. It's all about money here.
I'm not saying they're going to magically build a team overnight, but I'd say in testing the waters, there's definitely an audience for MML3, though I hate to say it does seem a vocal minority that's very interested. I have even recently felt that the 100,000 Strong goal, and reaching it, was in itself rigged, especially based on commentary given by the fellow running the place. (His comments about pushing things up to 500,000 strong in a week or something, and that it would be easy just seems completely invalid after it took 8 months to reach 100,000.)
Basically, I guess what I'm trying to say, is that maybe my comparisons were in fact a bit off, but at the same time I imagine that they do have sufficient resources to bring about the game. Capcom have hurt themselves in the cancellation of MML3. I don't say this as some rabid fan, but I will say that they have had monetary losses as a result of this. There are those that are boycotting Capcom or only bought games in series they've decided to stop localizing or making entirely. They seem to be trying to fix things by bringing in new IPs, but at the same time, one must note they're spending in the millions for these new IPs to get set up, when it wouldn't really cost them that much to, say, make a new entry in an existing one. If you look at Capcom right now, you only see "Street Fighter and Resident Evil Factory". People do want some old with their new, but honestly at the rate this is going, Capcom has effectively killed off english-language releases of Ace Attorney and Monster Hunter (both of which are cult hits, and made them pretty decent money) they killed off Breath of Fire years ago (still don't think Dragon Quarter was that bad...) and of course Mega Man was very much stretched out beyond reason, I understand the idea of cutting back. I do not, however, understand cutting MM off entirely.
Oh. And the reason the Devroom isn't expanding. It's just further evidence that the 100,000 likes was faked, unfortunately.
@above
ReplyDeleteYou have made very excellent points. Too bad this goddamned fanbase is too divided to act upon your advice.
Of course they'll deny it, a company this big will NEVER accept they're re-using a cancelled game's assets for a new one.
ReplyDeleteI call bullcrap on this one.
ReplyDeleteBut this doesn't mean we should give up on getting mega man legends 3 revived.
Boycott ex troopers at all costs.
@May 22, 2012 7:36 PM Anon: NO!
ReplyDeleteYou have to pick your boycotts carefully you fool!
We want Capcom to see there is a base for games like this on the 3DS. You boycotting this a) ruins the prospect of cell shaded games in general if it fails, b) shows games in that camera style and control scheme aren't popular on the 3DS, and c) That Capcom isn't really wanted on the 3DS.
We want Monster Hunter, Resident Evil, Street Fighter and this to succeed on the 3DS. To show Capcom it's hardcore fans are on the system, to show it has an established fanbase there.
Resident Evil was a success! The producer wants to make a sequel! Monster Hunter 3G and 4, before even released, were slated to the 3DS as exclusives. Street Fighter IV came out at launch day and has sold 1 million units.
You call the similarities on this and I say this: You boycott this and get this to fail and the heads at Capcom, which you constantly say are foolish and blind, will be lead to believe that, since this ran on the Legends 3 engine and still failed(supposedly), that Legends 3 has no chance.
Pick your fights, but don't be foolish about it.
@Takara_Kitsune
ReplyDeleteThe 100,000 likes movement was not rigged. It took around 9 months, actually, and each like was gained because of faithful fans that want the game in a legit, honest way. Not bitching, not moaning, but actively "proving". Achieving the goal in under a year's time since the game's cancellation is a strong proof. I don't recall the leader of the group saying anything like getting to 500,000 in a week. It was probably just an excited exaggeration due to the growing success at the time. So yeah, don't wrong any fans in this whole fiasco because all the fans did was help and support. The reason the Devroom doesn't have as many in number is due to Facebook being easier accessible versus the forums of Capcom Unity.
Also about stretching the franchise, you don't see Sega or Nintendo slowing down with Sonic or Mario. I'll very well compare Mega Man to those two. He gained extraordinary praise over the years alongside Sonic and Mario. Capcom really didn't have to cut back and it's a shame they let the blue bomber fall short over time. =/ I mean heck, Sonic has had some pretty poor games but Sega didn't let it hinder him.
At the rate of fans moaning like this, I'd have to say that no news is good news.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, even with the overall success of Mega Man 9 and 10, Capcom still doesn't view MM as a very worthwhile franchise. Keiji Inafune's departure proves it, since the only reason MMU and MML3 were started was because he used his high position to encourage Capcom to start development. But the moment he left and ranted about the Japanese game industry, Capcom eventually cancelled them. Inafune was pretty much the only person in CoJ that was passionate about MM. The rest of Capcom were not, especially since they consider MM to be "unpopular" in the west, and therefore decided to cut back.
That said, I'm willing to believe that Capcom has ALWAYS grown tired of MM, but couldn't cut back before because Inafune was still around and that he was probably whining on to their ears about it. Success in a game franchise doesn't always mean something. A company can still willingly cut back regardless of what.
Wanna a hint?
ReplyDeleteDon't trust Capcom. They have to earn our trust. Otherwise, they are nothing but a liar, betrayer, killing Megaman off, and useless.
I might be one of the people responsible for the conspiracy theory. >__>;; Wasn't serious, I swear.
ReplyDeleteNonetheless, I think Capcom's started grasping for straws. People are becoming increasingly annoyed by their abuse of DLC and inefficient recycling of resources, and it's starting to show.
Gundam fans are noting the depressingly low polygon count of the Gundam vs. Gundam series' newer installments.(Yes, the series is developed by Capcom, if my memory serves me correctly).
Monster Hunter fans bought up the 3DS in droves, but there's a decent number of them upset over Capcom's choice to put 4 on the 3DS. And the recent trends of Capcom have given rise to worries that Monster Hunter 4 on the 3DS is due to Capcom being too lazy to create newer HD models for the Vita.
DmC is being hit by massive criticism, particularly because it seems to have thrown out the "insane cool guy" atmosphere that the series is known for, and the fact that they discarded cheesy plot and cheesy cliches for even cheesier ones that attempt to add an air of excessive seriousness.
Capcom's fighting games are being criticized for having horrible game balance, and despite the fact that they're being hailed by some due to having 3D graphics, there are many people who think that Capcom's given up the ability to do intricate designs as a result. The recent onslaught of bugs and bad DLC practices involving such games are no laughing matter, either.
And when you consider that Arc System Works and SNK Playmore both specialize in making 2D games that look absolutely beautiful, you have to wonder if Capcom hasn't been too obsessive with their 3D graphics to really care about proper visual presentation through the usage of as many resources as possible.
And what's most worrying about their tendencies is the fact that they've shown a glaring disregard for their consumer base. Instead of trying to pitch their ideas to a consumer base to gather fans, they've attempted to steal the ideas of others as of late. Resident Evil has thrown its fanbase out the window in favor of CoD fans. MM has been thrown out entirely. Their fighters have been relatively less "tight" with power balance as of late, to the chagrin of many. DmC's tossed out the insane tripe for more HURR SERIOUS BUSINESS, sending many fans into a blinding rage.
To add to this they pretty much shot themselves in the foot with their "mascot" franchise with the cancellation of DASH 3 and Universe, effectively taking themselves out of the "appeal to all" 80's icon hit race by more or less discontinuing Rockman. In some sense it means that they've accepted the fact that they've lost the flagship war, and this reduces their status to that of a company that's older than most, but with nothing but franchises that are young in comparison to the big boys. That's not good for their image or lineage.
This stuff seems to be an attempt to prove that they're capable of innovating, to attempt to appeal to the fanbase. But again, there's the problem of Capcom's tendencies to shoot its fans in the foot. Anime style isn't bad, but the presentation of the trailer honestly worries me. They're tossing out Lost Planet's atmosphere for a light-hearted shounen anime atmosphere instead of a more in-depth series. This could backfire on them just as badly as past atmosphere shifts have, and would just add to the "Capcom doesn't give a damn about sustainable IP" theory.
Quite frankly, I think they're long past the point where they can rebuild trust. Especially not with the practices they've taken up.
@Everyone saying that no company would ever admit to it: Why the hell not? There's nothing wrong with admitting it, and it's most certainly been done before. Example: Capcom admitted that Capcom Fighting Evolution (or Capcom Fighting Jam) was just the Frankenstein'd corpse of Capcom Fighting All-Stars.
ReplyDeleteSure this is not MML3！
ReplyDeleteThis is Lost Planet!
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ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3r3ey6qWlBs
ReplyDeletethat's all that needs to be said.
Hey Takara_Kitsune,
ReplyDeleteThis is Jake Hans. I ran advertising for GetMeOffTheMoon to get to 100,000 last month and initially started recruiting a small team on MMLS to get 500,000 in 9 days.
The likes were generated by facebook advertising targeting generally both males and females from 16-25 who like anything associated with #game. It's no different than seeing ads on rockman-corner.com - someone under a company name is getting paid for their intelligence to raise awareness of a brand on the internet. GetMeOffTheMoon raised awareness for Legends 3 in the same way.
The bottom line is getting 500,000 likes would have cost roughly $12,000 on April 25th in advertising and would need to be paid a month in advance to facebook. Today the cost would be close to get $17,500 to get the same amount simply because of supply and demand. As quantity supplied goes down, price will go up to match quantity demanded. Because of personal inheritance and lucrative hobbies (not gaming lol) I have a lot of assets at my disposal. Everything was ready to go, but unfortunately it just takes a small amount of people to derail things. I'm not the leader anymore. I'm not the guy responsible for group's outcome and performance, although I wish the guys who are working on the next NeoDevroom event good luck.
You say the Devroom has only 20% GetMeOffTheMoon membership, and that proves the 100,000 goal was fake. Please notice Resident Evil has 45,000 members on Capcom-Unity, but 3,000,000 likes. That's 1.5% membership from facebook to Capcom-Unity. I wouldn't place too much importance on Devroom membership, and I think it was a mistake by Capcom to do so in the first place.
I understand the Legends revival efforts has done relatively nothing since reaching 100,000 and it reflects poorly on the movement. It's been noticed by our strongest supporters in Japan and Reika Morishita's manager. The positives though is that the Legends movement has all the tools needed to be successful. There just isn't a heartless businessman (what people called me) behind it anymore. lol If you think you have a creative vision, message them. The creator of the page will listen, he has in the past, he is the reason I had the opportunity to work with GetMeOffTheMoon so closely. If you have the skills to write that analysis, I know you have insight GetMeOffTheMoon can use. :)
Take care,
Jake
Oh and for the record Kitsune, I was planning to publish a full report on what happened with the advertising campaign on GetMeOffTheMoon that got us to 100,000 likes. Unfortunately I was removed as admin of GetMeOffTheMoon which resulted in me my business ads account being closed that had the capability to advertise in large dollar amounts (higher than then normal $50-250 per day) I was charged a small fee and all my statistics were lost. I am very sorry I can't just pull up an official facebook pdf to show exactly what happened. I can assure you though what happened was all real. :)
ReplyDeleteJake
This means everything is shared. Nor is it helping when the man does things, as this infers it is the woman's role. There are no roles, or need for scoring points. Things have to be done and they get done by one or the other person. topics to talk with a girl
ReplyDelete